GREEN GOAT RailPower Technologies Corp.'s Green Goat diesel-electric "switcher" was a promising technology because it is powered primarily by batteries (even when it idled) and employed its diesel engine only to recharge the batteries. Unfortunately, the Green Goat's batteries are known to have caught fire, forcing RailPower to recall, retrofit and update 59 units of the locomotive.
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Trains have long been a more fuel-efficient way to haul freight than trucks, but now the federal government's amped up support in the alternative energy arena may help "the iron horse" go even greener with hybrid locomotives and other advances.
Although large freight railway traffic (measured in carloads) is down 19 percent this year due to the recessed economy, it grew 47 percent between 1990 and 2007, and railroads have been more fuel-efficient than trucking for at least the past few decades, according to the Association of American Railroads.
The average train in 1980 used four liters of fuel to move one ton of freight 380 kilometers, and by 2007 the average increased to 700 kilometers, or three times the fuel efficiency of a truck, says Steven Forsberg, general director of public affairs with BNSF (Burlington Northern Santa Fe Railway) in Fort Worth, Tex.
New hybrid locomotives are designed to do even better, trading on the same technologies found in today's hybrid automobiles. General Electric uses a regenerative braking technology in its trains similar to that found in a Toyota Prius. The Mercedes-Benz Citaro fuel-cell transit bus set the stage for railroad energy-efficiency systems being created by hydrogen fuel-cell technology company Vehicle Projects, Inc. in Golden, Colo. And the Chevrolet Volt is the basis for an ethanol-based hybrid under development by Milford, Ohio–based Alternative Hybrid Locomotive Technologies, Inc. (AHL-TECH).
"The use of hybrid locomotives can reduce locomotive exhaust emissions and energy consumption, while providing an adequate or equitable amount of power to operate trains," says Warren Flatau, a spokesman for the U.S. Department of Transportation's (DOT) Federal Railroad Administration.
View a slide show featuring green train technology
Pros and cons
The challenges that arise in developing hybrid locomotives—such as power density and durability—are the same as in cars, but on a bigger scale because of the heavy load and harsh vibrations associated with rail freight, says Glen Merfeld, manager of GE Global Research's chemical energy systems lab.
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25 Comments
Add CommentHybrid technology doesn't make much sense for rail except for limited applications like switching cars in a yard. The typical train doesn't encounter much stop and go city driving.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisScooterdad strikes again!
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisDo yourself a favor and look up how locomotive engines have worked the last 50 years or so. Then consider doing a tiny bit of research before opening your big mouth again.
What we need to do is nationalize the RR tracks and bring them all up to standards with most being double tracks. The present track mess hurts everyone and greatly impedes modernizing the system. RR should be the same as the Interstate hwy system and charge train by the ton/mile to pay for track costs.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThen anyone with a train can go anywhere for real competition vs the fiefdoms of tracks we now have.
And by electrifying all the tracks would save a lot in the long run. Just float 20 yr bonds and let the revenue pay them off and little taxpayer $ need be spent.
Back in the 1950's-I think- SciAm had an article on a bus in Scandinavia that used a flywheel to slow and speed up...great idea. The article also pointed out that subways go up hill approaching a station and down hill leaving. Both good old ideas.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisLawrence Wackerman (a long time subscriber)
In my opinion -- it says something when big guys are into
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisgreen technology.
It was common and still is common to believe that big guys want get rid small guys when it comes to green energy.
Green Energy is a big tent. There is plenty of space for small companies and big companies.
It is important GE green go forward.
Because there are 100's or 1000's + of smaller companies
riding in their water wake.
I do not want to say anything good about a big company like
GE on green (federal kick- back). GE is sterotypical anti-green.
Maybe things have changed. Big guys can help the little guys get ahead.
Peace.
Once a battery of sufficient capacity can decouple the traction motor from the generator, you can use a much more efficient gas turbine or fuel cell to charge the battery. ETV Motors is using an LPG gas turbine to charge an extended range Prius and Honda is using a secondary Organic Rankin Cycle generator to use waste heat from the main hybrid generator engine. Combine these features and you could have a 65% efficient propane locomotive vs. a 30% efficient diesel. A cleaner and cheaper fuel and more efficient propulsion system.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisPS- The propane could even be used as the ORC working fluid and the expanded gas could be siphoned off as the gas turbine fuel, lowering the condenser load in the ORC cycle. The waste heat from the ORC could be used to heat a high pressure propane tank to further recycle energy for use by the ORC generator.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisPrior peson on list brought up an interesting point.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI could never understand why DOE spends so much time and money on fuel cells.
So in my mind --it is back to the same old thing.
GE green trains by fuel cells seem like F-22 Raptors.
Starting at 30 Million $ each -- they end up at 150 million
each.
If GE is involved as one leader of nuclear power industry--
then in ways all their so called green intiatives are suspect.
Superchargers on propane systems are more common sensical.
GE green fuel cell trains and F-22 Raptors.
I would like to give GE green trains benefit of doubt.
Yet it looks something like good old boy high priced kick-back here.
Peace.
People want products in the market place at a reasonable cost. This article's first sentence says volumes: "Trains have long been a more fuel-efficient way to haul freight than trucks, ...."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe modern diesel engine on rails is about as good as it gets.
The problem with trying to split this hair even finer is, there is a point of diminishing returns. At some point the battery, hybrid, & alternative fuel technology consumes more energy than it saves (ie: ethanol,etc.).
Even the most wizbang efficient battery tech is expensive and very environmentally unfriendly to produce, and like this article mentioned, big industrial batteries have a short life and, by nature, a their duty cycle makes them prone to explode (hello. OSHA?)
An all electric rail system sounds good ~if you can get past the HUGE start up costs~, but (and it's a big but) that electricity still has to come from somewhere!
Just ask Joe Biden.
Nope. Just like power plants & next gen autos, this 'clean green machine' narrative is more political than practical. It simply drives up costs, enlarges gub'mint, and drives away free enterprise.
The modern diesel engine on rails is about as good as it gets.
Let's not let the bureaucrats and tree sitting loons muck up a first rate, world class transportation system.
This is an absurd article and complete bunk.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisDiesel electric locomotives have always had a hybrid drive train, for the simple fact that trains are too heavy and require too much traction for a direct mechanical drive train. So the idea that hybrid drive trains for trains is making a technological leap from your charmless Toyota Pious is complete BS.
And most locomotives already use regenerative braking with a large heating element to dissipate energy, so simply adding some batteries and electronics to the system shouldn't be that big of a technological breakthrough.
What you don't grasp is the improved efficiency from using a low torque gas turbine genset feeding a large battery vs using a high torque diesel genset feeding a traction motor. The former is much more efficient in converting fossil fuel to power when run at a constant high speed but is less efficient when load on the genset varies to feed the directly connected traction motor, thus the need to decouple the motor load from the genset with a battery that current locamotives don't have. The fuel efficiency of all ICE vehicles can be more than doubled using a battery to decouple the motor load from a primary gas turbine primary genset and ORC secondary waste heat genset using off the shelf tech.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThank you. I swear, sometimes...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI know that in Switzerland about 70% of goods are delivered by train because preserving the environment. Also, they have a special system to carry trucks on trains, that they call 'rail-highway'. I know, the territories are different. They have falling water to produce energy - that it's enaught environmental friendly. Fuel trains desappear since long time in most part of Europe.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisBut let's say another thing: rail infrastructures cost a lot, but are less in number than road infrastructures.
Railpower Technologies Corp is already producing and selling hybrid locomotives
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAnd Railpower is selling them for switchyards where this technology makes the most sense, not long haul. Notwithstanding mr. hotblack's comment, this will be the primary use for this technology in rail.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisyes but are the bills to pay for those new hybrid cars also green or we are all going to finish "in the red"?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAndy
(the price of hybrid cars still sounds so very high to me)
yes but are the bills to pay for those new hybrid cars also green or we are all going to finish "in the red"?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAndy
(the price of hybrid cars still sounds so very high to me)
yes but how we gonna pay for those still extremely high priced
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thishybrid cars,we all know prices are still unaccessible for the
man of the street...
Andy
A big problem with using regenerative braking in any vehicle is that you have to dump huge amounts of energy into a storage system in a short amount of time. And pretty much every vehicle uses batteries be cause they have the highest energy density (by size and by weight) but if you charge them too fast the batteries have an annoying tendency to explode and still add lots of weight. This is why hybrid cars have to balance the benefit of more storage but heavier vs lighter but having to "dump" some recoverable braking energy. Since there is already existing technology for using a "third rail" to electrically power trains it seems you could install this only in places where a train is usually braking and then accelerating and use a much cheaper storage medium that is alongside the track instead of on the train. Keep the diesels for those long flat runs but when you pull into a station save your braking energy to use for acceleration without adding 20 tons of batteries to the train. Or the energy from one train braking going down a hill can help move a different train up that same hill at a later time. I would bet that this could be installed on less than 2% of all track and eliminate 50% of acceleration costs.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe LAST thing we need to do is nationalize the RR tracks. They are just fine. Big Train's *lust* for profit keeps them repairing the track far better than any national (read Communist/Socialist/High Tax) system ever could or would. As it is, trains are the single most cost-effective method of moving cargo across country when you compare how many miles they can carry a ton (2000 lbs) of cargo for $1 worth of fuel. Trains can move a ton of cargo about 500 miles for a dollar. Airplanes, by comparison, can only move that same ton a few feet for the same dollar.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAlso, RR retirement has remained private and OUT of the hands of the Federal Government, thus has remained about 3x higher payout than Social Security.
Socialize the track? At the firs whiff, every engine on every train will grind to a collective halt until the track is returned. Shutting down the trains would cripple this county. It would take 10 million more OTR trucks to replace the trains, and trillions of $ of extra maintenance to repair the damage to the Interstate system if that happened, not to count the shortage in extra fuel that would have been saved by the efficient train system that shut down upon Socialization. If you think socializing the track will keep it in better repair, read recent reports out of Germany about their failing tracks.
Socialism only works on paper.
I surprised someone even mentioned gas turbine powered engines. They are low torque as opposed to diesel which makes them prohibitive. Also, hybrids don't necessarily require batteries. Hydraulic and pneumatic storage devices which are a ton cheaper than batteries. Couple those storage devices to energy management systems for needs throughout the train. 20 hp diesel engine uses 1 gallon fuel per hour.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSo factor in energy required to stop or slow down a 500+ ton train and fuel consumption for onboard systems such as reefer (to average people, refrigerator) containers. Granted the reefer boxes chillers are not running constantly.. you could basicly dump excess energy (preferably hydraulic or pneumatic for long life durability) for fuel savings.
I agree socialize the track would be bad to some extent. Yet, to some extent it could help. I just rode a train through West Virginia and they are JACKED UP! That's heavily due to coal freighters demolishing them with heavy frequency of transports. Also, you even mention that millions of extra OTR trucks would be needed if trains disappeared. Same could be said if they add extra routes.
Whether you guys believe AGW.. some of us scientists are worried about proven oil reserves according to the CIA. Hypothetically using 1/3 of yearly consumption we would run out of oil in 120 years. Granted I know there are sources we have not tapped into.. Yet, it will be so expensive crippling world ecnomies which are dependant upon them. Imagine no cargo ships, no trains, and no semi-trucks.
Knowing what I told you.. wouldn't you consider not expanding railroad routes being irresponsible? Do you not care about your kids viability economically in the future?
I had to add more to retort jaqcp argument. People fight heavily for retirement pay and health care due to them being expensive. The world laughs at us for being so ignorant and drone like obeying private insurance.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIf we, the USA, switched to UK's system of taxation and health care -- which excludes Social Security (I prefer it not existing) -- your "Average Joe" family making 50K gross income yearly would stand to take home an extra 25% (12K) yearly. If you make double.. half the increase. The magnitude of extra goods and services purchased (as opposed on healthcare) would be an extra $720 BILLION yearly. Along with companies not having to shell out extra to cover health benefits would make them more profitable.. which is why our foreign auto makers are more viable as opposed to ours. Yes, Nissan and Toyota do assemble in USA. Yet, particular time consuming complex portions like engines are still made in Japan. We just do the grunt work.
The best way to make locomotives green and to save money is to fuel them with LNG.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this70 or 80 years ago, the Milwaukee Road (CMStP&P) crossed the Rockies with electric engines. On the downhill side, they used regenerative braking to pump electricity back into the overhead catenary, thus assisting engines on the uphill side.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThis intelligent system was driven out by cheap fuel and cheap GM diesels.
I love that we are coming out with hybrid transportation in the form of a train. I would totally take <a href="http://www.adamscole.com/locomotives">locomotives rolling stock</a> trains to work if they ran by my house. This sounds awesome!
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