After a loved one dies, most people see ghosts
Are you a scientist? Have you recently read a peer-reviewed paper that you want to write about? Then contact Mind Matters editor Jonah Lehrer, the science writer behind the blog The Frontal Cortex and the book Proust Was a Neuroscientist.
Vaughan Bell is visiting professor in the department of psychiatry at the Universidad de Antioquia, Medellín, Colombia. He blogs at Mindhacks.
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130 Comments
Add CommentI guess we can link that to the refusal of accepting death: I remember "news" about James Dean or Elvis not really dead but still living somewhere. It is restricted to certain individuals and a certain type of legend because it did not happen with Martin Luther King for instance. Could we explain resurrections the same way?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI wonder how the author is SURE that these experiences are hallucinations. He gives no information as to how he came to that conclusion. Although there is currently no "proof" of an afterlife, it seems to me that it is at least as likely that we continue to exist after our body dies as not. After all, there is something unique that goes on in our brains that is our persona. If it is not a purely physical effect, then a continued existence of that persona (our Soul?) would not depend on the existence of our physical bodies.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOnce one accepts the concept of "life after death", then the idea that the dead can communicate with us in a manner we do not understand is quite reasonable. I think the question is rather, "Why would we think they CAN'T communicate with us?"
" ...it seems to me that it is at least as likely that we continue to exist after our body dies as not."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAt least as likely? And you base that probability assessment on what?
So far, every aspect of our "persona" correlates with some brain function. Disruptions of it, whether by drugs, illness or injury, usually have manifestations in our cognition, sometimes dramatic ones. We might not understand precisely how brain function translates into consciousness, but we do know that the brain is absolutely crucial for the process. There is absolutely no reason at all to presume that any trace of our cognition would continue after the destruction of brain function.
"Once one accepts the concept of "life after death", then the idea that the dead can communicate with us in a manner we do not understand is quite reasonable. I think the question is rather, "Why would we think they CAN'T communicate with us?"
Accepting the concept of life after death is not reasonable at all. Anything that follows from doing so might make sense, but it can't be reasonable. The dead can't communicate with us because everything that made them what they used to be is destroyed. Period.
To MROTO - "Once one accepts the concept of "life after death", then the idea that the dead can communicate with us in a manner we do not understand is quite reasonable."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOccam's Razor - "The theory with the least amount of assumptions is correct."
The "life after death" hypothesis fails Occam's Razor. The simpler idea is hallucinations. We know how the brain works to trick itself and the body. Phantom limb pain, phantom blackberry vibrations, synaesthesia, Schizophrenia, etc.
Maybe the arm or leg is there, but in the ghostly ethereal realm, or your soul has leached into your pocket smart phone, the government could be sending signals through the color red. The amount of assumptions you have to hold to make theses idea fit reality is vast though. It is all simply answered with the brain trying to do what it does so very well with a change in the input stream.
This is great article and nice and brief critical look at a normal but rarely discussed phenomenon.
I think mroto has made a very valid point. Science is about the reproducible, measureable, observer-independent phenomena that make up most of our experience. As such it will never be able to deal with anything that is outside those bounds, such as an afterlife or a spiritual world. This does not mean that such a thing does not exist, just that it will not be ammeanable to a scientific study.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI know of many examples of extraordinary events that strongly imply a spiritual as well as a physical reality, but by their nature these can never be put in the lab and studied - they are all unique one-off events, as indeed we would expect if a spiritual reality consisting of personalities not subject to our usual physical laws existed.
One example: during the second world war my granny woke my father in the middle of the night convinced that another of her sons, Stanley, had just been fatally wounded and was calling to her for water. My father was able to reasure her that her son, and his brother was thousands of miles from the war front convalesing in hopsital after an earlier, non-life-threathening wound. However, granny, usually a very strong character, was inconsolable and convinced she had received a communication from her dying son. In actual fact my uncle stanley died that very night of a wound received at the battle of Knightsbridge. Unbenown to his family he had recovered from his previous injury and returned to his unit, and died that night in a German field hospital of blood loss - and hence in great thirst.
Co-incidence? chance? Maybe, but it would be rash to discount the possibility that there is more that just the physical. Scientists (of whom I count myself one) only do themselves a diservice and appear arrogant if they dismiss such a possible scenario.
I think mroto has made a very valid point. Science is about the reproducible, measureable, observer-independent phenomena that make up most of our experience. As such it will never be able to deal with anything that is outside those bounds, such as an afterlife or a spiritual world. This does not mean that such a thing does not exist, just that it will not be ammeanable to a scientific study.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI know of many examples of extraordinary events that strongly imply a spiritual as well as a physical reality, but by their nature these can never be put in the lab and studied - they are all unique one-off events, as indeed we would expect if a spiritual reality consisting of personalities not subject to our usual physical laws existed.
One example: during the second world war my granny woke my father in the middle of the night convinced that another of her sons, Stanley, had just been fatally wounded and was calling to her for water. My father was able to reasure her that her son, and his brother was thousands of miles from the war front convalesing in hopsital after an earlier, non-life-threathening wound. However, granny, usually a very strong character, was inconsolable and convinced she had received a communication from her dying son. In actual fact my uncle stanley died that very night of a wound received at the battle of Knightsbridge. Unbenown to his family he had recovered from his previous injury and returned to his unit, and died that night in a German field hospital of blood loss - and hence in great thirst.
Co-incidence? chance? Maybe, but it would be rash to discount the possibility that there is more that just the physical. Scientists (of whom I count myself one) only do themselves a diservice and appear arrogant if they dismiss such a possible scenario.
Why is it so difficult for people to believe just because they themselves have not had the experience? Ghosts are in the bible, so if you don't believe in the word, you don't believe in God. Jesus was the most famous of ghosts, and told his disciples he would haunt them. They supposedly heard his spirit speak to them... "I am with you always", right? there is also a passage in the book of Job, chapter 4, verse 15. "Then a spirit passed before my face. The hair of my flesh stood up. " I have spoken to my deceased mother in my dreams. She wanted to know how everyone was doing. Perhaps people who think ghosts are just a hallucination are a little jealous. People tend to belittle what they don't understand.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisHallucinating due to grief caused by the passing of recent loved ones is an assumption. If we did in fact have "hallucinations" due to grief why would we not hallucinate over the loss of relationships that did not necessarily end in death and for that matter what about objects that have a great deal affection? Reports of ghostly unfaithful girlfriends’ still roaming the bedroom or chilling images of a stolen iphone sitting on its charger would be reported at least as often as tales dead people. The uniform theme throughout these stories is the fact that someone has died. Many people who see ghost are not experiencing grief or even stressed at the time of the experience.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAnd what of documented testaments of ghosts at certain locations that had no personal connection to a multitude of witnesses at various times. Individuals that are not grieving have similar hallucinations of individuals that have passed. An explanation to this phenomenon is not offered in this hypothesis.
The writer or researcher for this article is confusing hallucinations such as Out-of-body experiences with ghosts which don't necessarilly have anything to do with the people who see them. People throughout history have reported seeing ghosts, but this person claims that every incident is a hallucination? Was this person there to witness or not witness these hallucinations? My sister had hallucinations when she was ill with shingles. I have heard that people under the influence of LSD have had hallucinations. Mr. Vaughn Bell might find himself in court for libel after accusing everyone who has seen or felt a presence of being a drug addict, alcoholic or ill in some way. His one-sided argument could be the result of stupidity or perhaps some mental defect that prevents him from being intelligent enough to know the difference between a hallucination and an actual ghost/spirit/spectre/haunt. Next he will tell us that the earth is flat, and anyone who thinks it is round is a heretic, and that big yellow thing we call the sun is just an illusion.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIt's all BS, until it happens to you, not once but many times. Now it it's quite common for me to experience the after life in this life of mine. Quite comfortable to tell you the truth. It happens so often it's no big deal.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSome more on this. There was a time when the world was flat along with other truths of the time that have since been found to be untrue or explainable. This too will come to pass about what life really is about. I don't want to get into belief systems here but I say to you all, do some research and separate the chaff from the grain and you will be surprised what you will find.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe way I see it, if there is some sort of "soul" that lives on after death it is immaterial. It would not have any mass and therefore no matter to it at all.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisEverything that we can visually see is made of matter, even smoke and fog and what not. If these 'wandering souls' are real, then we could never see or hear them SINCE THEY ARE NOT MADE OF ANY SORT OF MATTER.
If you can see a ghost, then it is something with matter and you should be able to permanently see it, instead of just for a second before it dissapears.
If it was made of only energy, then there would be a constant, measurable signature, just like electricity or radiation. Not just a few brief flickers on a "ghost meter".
More on this subject. I am quite comfortable with my experiences in this matter. There was a time when the earth was flat and there were witches and warlocks. These were truths, at that time. Now they are not. Consider this, your eyes, the image is in your brain, the sound you hear is in your brain, your touch, the feeling is in your brain. Your brain! Is this the organ that connects you to what you comprehend. I'm willing to bet that in the future we will have answers that we can't comprehend at the moment.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this?
It happened to my family repeatedly for years, until it was discovered that they were suffering from mild carbon monoxide poisoning, due to living in an ancient house. Once fixed, the ghost appearances stopped. Same symptoms can be had by hundreds of similar conditions.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisCausality is reality. Not as romantic as otherworldly spirits and eternal life, but as usual, the simpler, more down-to-earth solution wins. Nice work, Occam.
The wisdom of God is foolishness to man, and, the wisdom of man is foolishness to God. It is all perspective. To the countless number of people who claim to have seen the other side and gotten a positive benefit out of the paranormal I would say it is very real, more real than a skeptics scientific findings. So, please leave us to our delusions, and, we will happily leave you to yours. Peace...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSir James Jeans comment "The Universe looks more like a great thought than a great machine" and Erwin Schr�dinger's "Consciousness is a singular for which there is no plural" may offer a comforting extrapolation to those who contemplate where we were before we were born as well as after we die.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisLOL, this was sure to bring out the kooky crowd:-)
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisYes, if you sit in a room with a stove leaking carbon monoxide, you might "see dead people."
Similarly, if you are under stress, you might be susceptible to visions (particularly the more feeble-minded among us.)
And yes, you are likely to "see" whatever your culture has imprinted in your mind.
Boo!
Since I have had some personal experience with things unseen, I usually tend to give people the benefit of the doubt when they tell me their own experiences. I have a doctorate in a health science, but I am open-minded enough to realize that there are still many things about life (and death) that we don't understand. Oddly, I was talking to a man who had lost his son in Iraq today. His wife had seen the son after death as a warm, concrete presence who reassured her that he was happy and well. They are both atheists, so there was no complicating factors about religious beliefs here. I have heard other similar experiences.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisMy view is that our bodies, if you go down to the molecular levels, are made of atoms which, in turn, are made of energy. Therefore, we are essentially beings of energy. Mass is a relative term when you look at it that way. Our skin is made of atoms (thus, energy) which, for some reason unknown to me, manages to contain our atoms within it in a human shape. Our thoughts are energy generated from atoms in the neural pathways. Why is it that when our life ceases, this unknown force that contains our atoms in its human shape fails to continue to do so? That is a question for another day. Yet, the energy that composes us is never lost, and its mass is still present in our universe (E=mC2). I think that there is another force/power/influence that allows us to maintain our human shape when alive that withdraws at death. However, the energy pattern of our consciousness is still present.
My explanation (and it is, of course, only a suggestion) is that our "personalities" or "souls" are still very close to the state of being that it was just a part of and can pull together enough atoms to re-make a temporary body for just a fleeting moment when they sense the strength of grief of a loved one (more energy). What happens after that, I leave to others here for suggestions.
You have better, more scientific ideas of why our bodies hold together until we are dead and then disappear into separate atoms or do you just content yourself to let others do the hard work of actually thinking. It's easy to be a critic but not so easy to actually use your brain to think creatively. I'm listening.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thiswhy i feel that this happens is because the so called [soul or essence ]of our being never truly dies; because we are made up of energy never ending ;that can surpass time and space like opening a door;depending upon perhaps openmind to possibities that we cannot control;my personal expierance i was calm state and felt a presence; just like that; it is wonderful;be cause you know ; and furthermore if animals can sense these visits why can't we? are we that superior in our thought processes that this is a result of only grief related[ some say]; these visits are REAL the mind is made up of complexities that we may never truly ever understand; maybe we should stop sometimes to smell the roses so to speak....the only way to fully understand is when it happens to yourself.. seeing is beliving...ect,,
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this"...I have a doctorate in a health science ... I think that there is another force/power/influence that allows us to maintain our human shape when alive that withdraws at death...."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisNow, this IS funny. Must be the kind of doctorate they give by correspondence, or from a madrassa.
I was wondering whatever happened to the "energy atoms" of the first Mac I used to type papers on, but now I know: The "energy atoms" of John The Baptist are mingling with it, and gibberish is appearing on this board. Coincidence...? Perhaps not....
i have expierenced as they are called ADC [after death commuication]they are real ; for what ever reason these visits occur i feel that life never ends. the mind/ essence of our being continues to thrive ; the mind is so complex that we cannot even begin to understand its true capabilities; how we can pass from the phyical state to the astral state ; to interchange ; my feeling is that in order to encompass such a concept is expierance; openmindness that anything can be possible ;
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisNO, They are not hallucinations ! My brother came to me BEFORE I knew he died. He wanted me to not be afraid , because I was going to have to go and find him at his house. when I did find him , then it made sense to me why he came to me. I found my brother hanging behind his door. I know now that this was a gift my brother had given me, to know there is another side, and his presence was the most peaceful and wonderful I will ever know .
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI have never experienced a near death experience, but I have been following the research in death and dying since I was a student listening to a then little known Elizabeth Kubler-Ross lecture to my class. I have no doubt that they are real. I read her last book written just as she was dying. She and her associates firmly believed in authenticity of these experiences. Further, she believed that they had something to teach us here and now in this state of being. Again, the only explanation I have as to why our physical bodies remain contained within the our bodies until the time of death when it seems that this life force (energy, again) leaves our bodies.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe real mystery is the true nature of life. Until I am convinced that we understand all of the underlying principles of this amazing universe, I won't discount any proposals anyone has to make. As has been said before, the earth was once thought to be flat and so on. Rather than believe in a strictly acausal universe which is where we are presently since science cannot currently explain everything that happens here, I believe that there are other principles yet to be discovered which will make sense of so many of our questions. I don't see why the border between life and "death" shouldn't be one of them. In fact, I am think that we as a species are poised on the brink of another evolutionary leap that involves our ability to perceive the unseen world. Humans have made many other such leaps before, and civilization as we know it was not possible until it happened. We may be able to perceive other states of being then that we are not able to now - except for some who have made their voices known here. Just because the researcher assumes that these experiences are not "real" doesn't mean that they aren't. It may be that he is one of those who is not capable of sensing anything else. How can we develop instruments to measure or register forces that we don't even realize are there yet?
I believe in the future and the convergence of "hard" science with that of other types of explanations. This process has already happened in so- called modern medicine. Just today I read about the use of a "revolutionary new bandage" soaked in honey to heal wounds that have not responded to conventional treatment. The researcher admitted that it was an idea stolen from history just as the use of maggots to clean dead tissue from wounds was. We cannot see until we look.
I never believed in ghosts until I was working in an office that had many. Little kids could see them and we could hear footsteps when no one was on the stairs. The building was near a graveyard which may have had something to do with it. This was definitely not a case of missing one's deceased relatives.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI never believed in ghosts at all until I was working in an office building in Tokyo that had a lot of them. Little kids could see them and would start crying but their mothers would say they were just imagining things. We could often hear footsteps on the stairs when no one was there. There was one particular room that always felt really cold no matter what the weather. I was very glad to leave that place. It definitely wasn't a case of hallucinating deceased relatives because none of us had any at the time.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI'm astonished to see so many credulous comments on a website with "scientific" in the title. People need to learn some psychology and realize how easy it is for the brain to perceive things that aren't there. I'd suggest checking out this article http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=never-say-die
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIt's about the psychological mechanisms at work that make it difficult for us to imagine death. Oh and to the people who say that these "paranormal" events are somehow outside the realm of science and yet still exist; there is one universe! There are things that are causally connected to reality, and things that aren't. Either these things interact with us or they don't. Occam's razor tells us they're simply psychological artifacts.
Occam's Razor has been referred to several times here, always as a way to dismiss claims of the paranormal.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOccam's Razor states that the simplist explaination is the correct one. Einstein famously said this about scientific explainations: An explaination should be as simple as possible, but no simpler. Therefore, Occam's Razor is neither proof, nor denial for any of these arguements.
I've seen my mother in law, many years after her death, but in the home of her favorite granddaughter. My father came to show he his fixed teeth, and several others came , one of whom said "I said a prayer for you." My mother came to see my sister twice and her stroke damaged arm looked better each time. My ex came to see his oldest son who said he looked emaciated, which we do not understand. Work in progress?I know several people who just blanch when told these stories.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSarah
To ignore the presence of an "after life" is very unscientific in my opinion. The reality of some kind of other world was brought home to me about two years ago when my dog died at the vet. Within a minute from receiving the phone call telling me of the dog's death there was a sharp loud sound in the next room as I sat at my computer. Because I was the only one in the house I was more than a little surprised. I slowly opened the door of the room while turning the light on and was amazed to see a cane that I had carried when walking the dog to provide protection against a free roaming aggressive dog was laying in the middle of the floor. I always kept that can standing in a corner of the room where the dog slept. Somehow the cane had "flown" from the corner and apparently had loudly banged (judging from the sound) against the glass sliding door of the room and then fell to the floor. I took a photo of the cane as it lay there. This was absolutely no hallucination! I think such experiences are not that rare but our science doesn't yet know how to deal with them. So it pretends they don't exist.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI already know about psychological mechanisms that cause problems with altered perceptions. I have even read the recent article on this site on why we can't imagine our own deaths. However, I am astounded at some people's lack of depth of information. If someone is going to totally discount another's experience, he should at least have a nodding acquaintance with a broader array of knowledge. According to recent developments in physics, there are many universes which may all have their own laws of nature.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAs for reality, we attach that label to what we can see, hear, feel, smell, or touch. If you have ever had an intuition about something, thought about someone who immediately called on the phone, or had any other such experience, then you have been in touch with another sense. It has not currently been explained by scientists, but that doesn't mean anything. In the Dark Ages, it was inconceivable to them that tiny creatures too small to be visible to the eye were causing diseases such as The Plague or Cholera. They could not put a cause with an outcome. It did not exist in their world view, and anyone who claimed so would probably have been burned as a witch - especially if he had stumbled upon that faithful bread mold antibiotic, penicillin, which would have cured many of those illnesses in an apparently miraculous way! It was an acausal principle as far as they were concerned.
The same situation exists here. These "ghost" stories abound across cultures with similar features. If you don't possess the ability to sense the universe in this way, you would naturally not believe it much as those Dark Age witch burners wouldn't. This ability to sense beyond the five senses is becoming more and more common. If you don't have it, perhaps your children will. Otherwise, there may be ways of communicating and understanding the universe we live in that develop in the future that are as unintelligible to you as the concept of bacteria was to the Dark Age physicians. It requires a crack at an open mind. Try it. The universe is a mysterious place still. We have only scratched the surface of understanding it so far, and there is no room for absolutes at this point.
Read up on physics. You will see that physicists are at a point where the physical world and the spiritual world are starting to coalesce in their equations. Many of their advanced equations only work if an observer is taken into account. How is it that an observer is getting mixed up in mathematical equations? The universe is still a mystery!
How does the author KNOW that these are hallucinations and not real visits from the deceased? Apparently the author has had a very limited life.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI was sitting on the porch of a European holiday chalet when I was overwhelmed by the feeling that my father, from whom I had become estranged, and who lived half a world away in Australia, had just died. Four months later I learned from my sister that he had indeed died four months previously, at the time that I felt the event. Since I was not experiencing grief at the time, I could not have been, as it were, mentally primed for this event. In fact, my thoughts were simply with the holiday situation in which I then found myself. Given that this incident was emotional rather than a visual 'halucination' did not make it less real, and neither, I am sure, is such an experience unique to myself. Science (at least, good science) proceeds by exercising humility in the face of the unknown.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisTo Kritof: "If we did in fact have "hallucinations" due to grief why would we not hallucinate over the loss of relationships..." Don't you? I don't think it was ever confined to bereavement, simply that this elegant explanation could be applied to it. I know of people seeing a lover who had left them when he wasn't there - he was still very much alive though. As for phantom lost ipods etc do you not think there may need to be a slightly stronger love as you would for example have for a pet or ex partner...such a link would have involved an emotional response and consequently engaged particular physiological structures and chemicals within the brain. There need not be an ambiguous explanation just because this issue has always been tiptoed about. I don't know enough about the correlation between stress and hallucination to comment but it does strike me that strong familiar clues may evoke memories of a person in a similar way to deja vue and could this be a factor?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOccam's Razor - "The theory with the least amount of assumptions is correct."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOkay, why is this accepted as true?Newtonian physics is simpler than relativity. Demons possessing a mentally ill person is simpler than the current theories of mental illness.
The point is that the author fell into a trap that many do - he accepted his own preconceptions as fact and based his conclusions accordingly. If he is a "scientist", he cannot accept anything at face value. He must prove, or at least provide compelling evidence of, all of his basic assumptions.
On the topic of life after death, as others have pointed out, the anecdotal evidence goes far beyond "seeing ghosts". Although there is currently no scientifically accepted method of proving any of this, the sheer volume of experiences from all sorts of people - many with unimpeachable credentials - provides a compelling argument for the continued existence of our souls after our bodies die. Our failure to understand how this could be does not make it impossible, or even unlikely.
Occam's Razor - "The theory with the least amount of assumptions is correct."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOkay, why is this accepted as true?Newtonian physics is simpler than relativity. Demons possessing a mentally ill person is simpler than the current theories of mental illness.
The point is that the author fell into a trap that many do - he accepted his own preconceptions as fact and based his conclusions accordingly. If he is a "scientist", he cannot accept anything at face value. He must prove, or at least provide compelling evidence of, all of his basic assumptions.
On the topic of life after death, as others have pointed out, the anecdotal evidence goes far beyond "seeing ghosts". Although there is currently no scientifically accepted method of proving any of this, the sheer volume of experiences from all sorts of people - many with unimpeachable credentials - provides a compelling argument for the continued existence of our souls after our bodies die. Our failure to understand how this could be does not make it impossible, or even unlikely.
Let me narrate my real life experience when I was just 22 and consumed by the question whether God really existed. One day in the twilight, I was walking across a lonely hillock-path and about half a mile away in a cemetery I saw a white hazy silhouette. After the immediate feeling of fear, I wondered if it was a ghost and it were to be true, that will make a good evidence that God also exists. I gathered courage and started walking towards the open cemetery. On reaching there I laughed loudly finding that it was just a donkey standing happily after a full days graze !
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThis narration is just for a comic relief. The undeniable truth, however, is that ghosts are just the figment of imagination out of our deep desire and greed to seek extension of life beyond death. The great Indian philosopher, Jiddu Krishnamurti was once asked whether we are the creation of God. He said, Its the other way around. God is our creation and not that we are his creation. I wish we were, then we would have been quite different!
Mysticism and metaphysical beliefs hold tenacious fascination for mankind from the dawn of history as an escape from the boredom of the mundane and problems of life. One also has a funny reward that these cannot be proved or disproved.
Rajnish Roy
He bases his assessment on the documented fact of people leading normal lives despite not having a brain. There was recently the case of a man in France who had over 90% of his brain destroyed by hydrocephalus and he only symptom he showed was a slightly slurred speech.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe ONLY conclusion you can reach is that the brain is not always an essential component of human thought an intelligence.
Occam's Razor is not, "The theory with the fewest assumptions is correct." This is a common misunderstanding. It should read, "The hypothesis with the fewest assumptions--which also explains all of the available data, is to be preferred." This is a far cry from allowing one to conclude that the hypothesis is correct. Occam's Razor is not an axiom of logic, but merely a guideline. Unfortunately, it is all too often abused.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe thing that gets me is why people with no knowledge of or respect for science read this journal and take the time to post comments. When you tell us that Ghosts, UFOs, Jesus, The Tooth Fairy, Etc are real because you personally experienced them we don't think, gosh science is wrong because whoever says so; we think you are, delusional, mentally challenged, on drugs or lying. It is very simple people; if you dont like the results of a scientific investigation, conduct one of your own. Science isnt just something a scientist can do. A number of years ago a young girl conducted an experiment to verify the claims of therapeutic touch practitioners. Her results appeared in JAMA. Feel free to be critical of experiment results, challenge theories, formulate hypothesis, do the work but dont expect the scientific world to pivot on your personal experiences. Mental institutions are full of people who see the world differently from the one described by science and as is often said, There are more out than in . And as Herb Tarlek said, Its bad luck to take advice from insane people&
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisTo MROTO - "Newtonian physics is simpler than relativity. Demons possessing a mentally ill person is simpler than the current theories of mental illness."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisFirst off, read what you quote. I did NOT use the term "simpler" for a reason.
Occam's Razor - "The theory with the least amount of assumptions is correct."
Now let's put Newtonian physics and Relativity to the knife. Newtonian physics could not describe the orbit of Mercury. We would have to assume that there might be something disturbing the cycle. Relativity predicts the orbit. No assumption means it passes.
let us look at Demon possession and brain disfunction. Demon possession assumes there is a super natural world not governed by the laws of nature. These demons are willful beings and like to inhabit people. These demons can be exercised. All of these are assumptions with no evidence. Brian disfunction can be tested with fMRIs, through psychological analysis, and with medication. This is all scientific evidence and doesn't harbor any assumptions. It passes the test.
See with the supernatural you start off with a big assumption, "there is something in the natural world that is not of the natural world." This premise is contradictory and illogical. If Ghosts and such occur so naturally everyday, why is it "supernatural"? Yes, science is always changing, it grows and adapts and brings in new information. But these ghost stories have been around since stories have been told. They are still just stories with no actual evidence.
The plural of anecdote is anecdotes, NOT data.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
The burden of proof is on those that make the claim.
You can't prove a negative.
Lack of evidence one way or another doesn't not give weight to an idea. It means you need more evidence.
Critical thinking, learn it, use it.
To FRGOUGH - "There was recently the case of a man in France who had over 90% of his brain destroyed by hydrocephalus and he only symptom he showed was a slightly slurred speech."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisHave an article or any other evidence to back this up? My Google-fu was not strong enough to find any news articles or stories that mention this. If you do find some your statement is still only anecdotal. I can say my grandpa lived to be 112 while smoking cigarettes every day. does that make cigarettes healthy?
I am a scientist. I observe.l I report. I categorize. And I have experienced remarkable events in this realm of this article. Just 24 hours post mortem, I experienced what is in the category of "sympatheitic pregnancy symptoms."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisMany men "feel" labor pains of their pregnant spouses. And as a child of deceased parents, I felt atypical pains which my dying parents likely felt. Just for a few hours, a day after they died. I theorize that formaldehyde transforms a dead body into a transmitter. A ultra low wave transmitter that can send a basic painful message. My father had severe leg pains, I as a healthy 37 year aged athlete, had pains I never had before or since for the few hour episode. My mother died of ovarian cancer. I did not want to have a hallucination. We all ate the same pizza as we gathered where she died in home hospice. No one else had severe stomach pains. Why I experienced this all does not make the bible true or Jeebus survive a crucifixion 19 centuries ago. But if there is any verification of such events, it will take technologies to do it, not speculating or believing. What I have not read above or below is any substantial two way communication. I experienced a single painful msg twice, 13 year s apart. Not ghosts. Not words. Not flying objects. Just a possible transmission of a dead body residual effect I could share through any medium. If that is not the case, I was subconsciously inducing an idiopathic symptom. Not all that different from my active dreams. We ought to be discussing this rationally. Not let the hell threat & heaven bribing theocrats dictating our results in advance. Creationism & intelligent design liars are ripe to reap more millions in donations for the faithful, if such discussions & investigations are co-opted. Duke University is famous for that sort of crap. Beware the bible sellers & new agers selling runes & crystals. And the aroma therapy lobby. One placebo or another can be a dangerous diversion from proven therapies. Some loonies will drink purple poison, like HeavensGate or Jim Jones. Mixing pseudo science and religion is dangerous. Keep wishful thinking out of articles in SciAm & stick to rigorous protocols & unbiased observers. There is only the natural. Alleged deities & alleged supernatural effects are irrational by definition. No miracle has ever happened. No absent limb ever restored by prayer, yet re-attachment surgery is improving. What is that fake photo of a "ghost" in this article?
Panpsychism energy exists in and on all things that are matter, animate or inanimate.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisPanpsychism is a form of awareness or consciousness that exists in all matter, animate or inanimate..
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI agree that life persists and haunts after death. I have a couple of experiences which does not fall under any other purview but simply visiting from the grave...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisPanpsychism is an awareness or form of consciousness that exists in all matter whether animate OR inanimate.. so, possible but hard to verify..
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI agree that life persists and haunts after death. I have a couple of experiences which does not fall under any other purview but simply visiting from the grave...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe author also didn't mention how he explained the movement of items in a room that couldn't have possibly moved themselves. I have had my keys taken, then replaced, when NO ONE ELSE was home. I came home from running errands one afternoon and placed my keys in their usual spot. I knew exactly where I left them, and they weren't there when I went to get them later. Then, after frantically looking for them for over 30 minutes, they reappeared exactly where I had left them before. During the time of frantic searching, my son came home from school and I had him look to see if I missed them--sometimes what you look for is right under your nose. He confirmed they were gone. Then, together, we found them later. I suppose we both hallucinated they were gone and then returned.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisHe also doesn't address the phenomena of hauntings that are completely unrelated to someone. How does he explain those?
Actually, I have experienced what could be called a hallucination during a very painful divorce. Soon after I separated from my husband, I moved to a new home, The first night I was there, while alone in my bedroom trying to fall asleep, an apparition of my husband hovered at the foot of my bed. And, then it disappeared. In those few seconds, I saw him give me a very melancholy look. The apparition was not frightening. It was if he were trying to tell me something, but he left before I could "hear" it.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOne can grieve mightlily at the loss of loved one who is still alive. Of course, my husband -- or, rather the relationship we had, was now "dead."
These posts are clear evidence, that while the US is home to some of the best and the brightest, it is also home to some of the dumbest and most ignorant (religiosity statistics certainly support this one.)
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI am just hoping, that most of these posts are produced by only one or two individuals, using different names, who are in dire need of medication.
I would argue that these types of hallucinations are not necessarily brought on by grief, but rather by a change in any familiar sensation. I used to have the same cat hallucination described in the article, only the cat wasn't dead. My parents had a cat, and when I moved out into an apartment, I would still think I saw her out of the corner of my eye. Believe me, I was not missing the cat (she's not very friendly...and I'm allergic), I was just used to seeing her slinking around. And sometimes if I forget my wedding ring, I will still feel like it is on because I'm so used to it being there. Also not grief related. And on another note, also not a ghost. I don't think the author is saying ghosts don't exist. Just that this phenomenon can account for some of the presences people often experience after the death of someone close.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe glib assumption that such apparitions have no basis in reality arrogantly ignores the fact that the origin and purpose of consciousness (subjectivity, interiority, qualia, phenomena, the raw-feel of experience) has never been satisfactorily explained. What's so special about brains that they are thought to be the only medium for consciousness? After all, they're made of the 94 elements of the earth complexly arranged, yes, but still purely material. The most viable explanation for the undeniable presence of consciousness is panpsychism, the intuitive notion that the entire universe is ensouled with consciousness, and that humans are but one of very many possible manifestations of it. Given that, then we must not be so quick to explain away one of the most enduring mysteries of human existence.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOh dear, the lunatics have taken over the asylum................
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisGood article, terrible comments. I thought this was a science website.
I wonder who has proven that there is not an afterlife? We have many people who have experienced visions and so forth, not necessarily from those they have loved/missed, but have seen, witnessed and even smelled strange things that cannot be explained. I myself have experienced such a thing when my father died. You might argue that I missed him and that is why I smelled his very distinct scent , except for the fact that I was not close to him at all and barely knew the man. Also, I grew up in a house that was haunted by 3 separate entities and many incidents occurred that were witnessed by more than one person. Why does the body lose an ounce at the moment of death? What is it that is leaving the body? When measured, even though bodily fluids are released, the body, when placed on a scale before death, and left on there after death, shouldn't loose an ounce but does. Now to the comment about Jesus being a ghost, that is incorrect, He appeared physically resurrected from the dead, hence to "doubting" Thomas, He had him place his fingers into His wounds to prove it was indeed He in the flesh. Witnessed and reproduced.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisthe author sites no studies or documentation of any kind just asserts that "people aren't seeing what they are seeing...they're grief stricken and elderly..." and we are to accept these conclusions based on what? i would much rather take the word of an eyewitness than the opinion of a third party with an obvious agenda. What makes people into 'professional skeptics?" Why do some people need to tell us we are not seeing what we are seeing? i think more study should be done on the personality issues
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisof "debunkers." Most of the "debunking" i have seen seems to go on far less factual information, research or observation and on far more generalizations than many eyewitness reports.
"Mental institutions are full of people who see the world differently from the one described by science"
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWhich world is that? I see people here spouting the absolutes of science as the only perspectives that are worthy of consideration, and I wonder how old they are. Do they not remember any truly revolutionary scientific breakthrough? Do they think that the world as "described" by science today is actually the way it is? Is there no room for discovery and advances? In fact, science is still struggling to "describe" our universe and the laws which govern its operation.
There is now an on-going contest between two theories about the existence of dark matter. Although the dark matter theory has explained so much about the cosmos, it has never been measured or even detected despite huge sums of money and time spent for this purpose. Still, a whole theory of cosmology has been built on its existence. The world as described by science.. hmmm. Well, now there is a competing theory that not only does not rely on the existence of this purely theoretical material, it also explains more about the measurements of galactic movement than the old one does. It is poised to suddenly change the whole picture of modern cosmology, and it morphs the hallowed Newtonian 2nd Law of Physics into something quite revolutionary. Science is now describing the world (or universe) in a different way! Indeed, the existence of this magical substance called dark matter may be totally de-bunked leaving years of research suddenly obsolete. Read more in this link:
http://discovermagazine.com/2006/aug/cover
Before you formulate a hypothesis, you gather information. Classic scientific method. In this case, this anecdotal evidence may not look like this gathering portion of a scientific theory, but that is what it is. As has been said, there is simply too much of it to completely ignore something happening for which there is not YET an explanation. This author's opinion has flawed his method, as has also been said. Those who scoff at these stories as lunacy may soon be remembered by history along with the people who burned Giordano Bruno at the stake for joining Galileo in proclaiming his theory that the earth revolves around the sun!
I don't believe in god. This kinda invalidates your arguement for me and many other people.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI saw a documentary once about electro-magnetic radiation having a similar effect. They were able to induce feelings of a 'presence' in many people. Some people are more susceptible than others, and in one example a person who had repeatedly been feeling a 'presence' in their bedroom had this cured by removing the clock-radio from beside there bed.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI agree, there is no evidence cited in this article to support the hallucination hypothesis. I disagree about something 'not physical' going on in our brain, though. I don't subscribe to the Descartes style dualism philosophy, I think we will ultimately have a physically based explanation for this sort of phenomenon. And given how strange quantum physics seems to me at times, I'm not going to discount some sort of ongoing effect of a no-longer living entity.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisYeah, I once saw skeletons doing a cavalry charge. Jackon Pollock is awesome on mushrooms :-)
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisNo-longer living entity? And so much for open-minded, unbiased observation of evidence...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI think that the reason that we think people have an afterlife, or "can contact the other world" is possibly because our minds are unable to comprehend that there is nothing after death.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this-Science is about explaning things objectively by reproducing experiments in a controlled environment;
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this-Science is about building theories based on few principles like causality;
-Occam's razor is about explaining any phenomenon making as few assumptions as possible, eliminating those that make no difference in the observable predictions.
-Personal experience, as weird as it can get, is never a scientific fact.
-Personal hypothesis about life after death (or else) don't say anything about reality, personal theories even less!
The problem boil down to: Is there any way we can test the assumption of life after death? And even those tests are positive, do we have a theoretical frame to put it in. If one of those two things are missing, we cannot say ANYTHING about its existence or not, in a scientific way. Nevertheless, it SEEMS to point toward a non existence.
Now this is for science as we know it. The public, looking-from-outside science. I believe there is a, still objective, looking-from-inside science that can be pursued. This science may give some other information about reality that looking-from-outside science cannot reach. And this can only be proven by the seeker of this looking-from-inside science. It is not a public science amid the fact that two seekers can talk about the same things they did or experiment and find that they talk about the same objective thing. But this is tricky because how do you differentiate between two weirdos hallucinating the same thing and two seekers having experienced the same objective "thing"? You have to engage yourself on the path of the looking-from-inside science!
Hmm, while the author seems to be accurate with situations involving "loved ones" - the article does not deal at all with appearances of dead people to those who knew them not at all. I know two people (separated by years and some distance) who had encounters with ghosts which were so real they caused physical reactions by the percipients. In both cases: these living people had purchased the home of a recently deceased previous owner.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAlso in both cases, others (visitors) saw things like a water tap being turned on and off and a bookcase falling over - with no one else present at the scene (but present in other rooms of the house).
Hallucination? I'm not so sure.
Sigh, of course they are hallucinations, just deal with it please.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWOW it's amazing how there is a scientific answer to absolutely everything - even peoples reaction to death.. I became carer of my mother in her last 6 weeks of life. She had been involved in a horrific bus accident some years prior where my father (her husband of 30+ years) had died along with 3 others. The bus came off a 30 metre mountain in Tasmania whilst touring the native wildlife. My mother suffered horriffic injuries and never quite recovered both physically and mentally. Her oncologist did suggest that perhaps the cancer was a result from the traumatic injuries caused by the crash.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisMy mother and I spoke extensively about dying, death and the unknown. You see, my mother had been a nun for seven years before she moved into nursing and met my father. And although she left the nunnery she never lost her incredible faith.. Our talks were all about the final resting place after death and because my father had never tried to contact my mother to let her know where he was, this made my mother very fearful and questioning whether heaven really existed.
My mother promised me that no matter how hard it was she would try her hardest to let me know she arrived safely and at peace (out of pain) somewhere. A couple of nights before her funeral I woke up to find my mother lying perfectly still next to me in the clothes she was buried in. She was not breathing just lying perfectly still at peace. I turned to her asked her if she was ok and got out of bed to get her pain medication. When I turned to look at her again realising that she was no longer with us - I saw that she had gone.
Now I am not a believer in ghosts and the like BUT I sure do believe that that was my mother sending me a sign to let me know that she had arrived safely and out of pain to her final place of rest which in her truth is heaven.
Alida Shannon
The publication of this article was an interesting scientific experiment in itself.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe reactions to the article has demonstrated two things rather well.
1) that hallucinations are common and
2) that the experience of the hallucination is sufficiently intense and detailed enough that the subject sincerely believes that the experience is reality.
I suffered one such stress induced hallucination. What troubled me was the extraordinary reality of the experience. It was convincingly detailed and internally coherent. But, when looking back, plainly impossible.
Having experienced such an hallucination I can understand why others sincerely report hallucinations as real experiences. And the replies above demonstrate just how common this is.
Peter
Astounding how many woo-woo nuts troll these comments.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWhen you "see" somobedy, what's happening is that electromagnetic energy hitting this entity is re-emitted and reaches your rettina, which will transform this energy into electrical signals that are processed by your brain. Whatever the experience these people have with the departed, they certainly didn't "see" them. Do they exist? Well, define the work "exist". They don't radiate electromagnetic energy. They affect only one individual (not two persons experiment the encounter in the same way). Then the question of wether they really exist or they exist only in the living person's psyche becomes irrelevant. As they don't produce any change in the environment except for the neuronal processes of the perceiving subject, you have no way to study the phenomena except for interrogation and cerebral scans.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisDo they exist? Only if you see them.
The posts here argue this theory believing they have all the information to form a scientific hypothesis. That is implicit in their statements of Occam's Razor. You must know all the facts to eliminate all but the simplest with the fewer assumptions.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisBut human physiology, physiology of sight, allows the subliminal detection of movement only, as opposed to the full range of conscious sight. Several posts remark that they have seen things in peripheral vision. That is not possible. Stationary objects in true, subliminal, peripheral vision, are invisible. Subliminal sight reports movement and position only. When movement is detected the brain 'fills in' color and shape from memory. That could easily be the most recent stressful experience including those about the recent death of a loved one.
Hallucinations can be born from this simple fact of physiology. Repeated subliminal detection of threat-movement in a compact time frame can produce a psychotic-like mental event. This was discovered in offices in the 1960's but so few people are aware of it that is unknown by most of the scientific community.
It is revealed in first semester psychology lectures on psychophysics. Named Subliminal Distraction, it can be investigated by researching activities known to cause mental breaks. VisionAndPsychosis.Net did that beginning in 2002.
Before you testify to your belief you should be aware of Subliminal Distraction and eliminate it as the source of your visions and supernatural experience.
To Mr. Schmidt:
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisYou said we should feel free to challenge theories. That's exactly what I'm doing. The author of the article concludes that all instances of people sensing someone who has died are hallucinations, but gives no valid arguments for this conclusion. Hardly in keeping with the scientific method. Did he, as a scientist, conduct any investigation as to whether or not there could be another cause? If he did, he didn't report it in his article.
I think that hallucinations are a likely explanation of at least some "sightings", just not the only one. Had he written the article with that tenor, I wouldn't have commented.
One possibility for these "out of the corner on my eye" type of hallucinations is the brains habit of turning everyday objects into symbols. This is why we might not notice anything different about a spouse or common object in our home. This object has been replaced by a mental symbol in our brain. So until something causes use to LOOK at something the symbol provide the assumed appearance. In the same way if we had a cat that passed on, every shape or combination of shapes/shadows that were cat-sized and placed appropriately (cats don't fly so the illusion would happen with airborne objects) would trigger this symbol until we actually turned to look or brought our conscious attention to it.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOne possibility for these "out of the corner on my eye" type of hallucinations is the brains habit of turning everyday objects into symbols. This is why we might not notice anything different about a spouse or common object in our home. This object has been replaced by a mental symbol in our brain. So until something causes use to LOOK at something the symbol provide the assumed appearance. In the same way if we had a cat that passed on, every shape or combination of shapes/shadows that were cat-sized and placed appropriately (cats don't fly so the illusion would happen with airborne objects) would trigger this symbol until we actually turned to look or brought our conscious attention to it.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOne possibility for these "out of the corner on my eye" type of hallucinations is the brains habit of turning everyday objects into symbols. This is why we might not notice anything different about a spouse or common object in our home. This object has been replaced by a mental symbol in our brain. So until something causes use to LOOK at something the symbol provide the assumed appearance. In the same way if we had a cat that passed on, every shape or combination of shapes/shadows that were cat-sized and placed appropriately (cats don't fly so the illusion would happen with airborne objects) would trigger this symbol until we actually turned to look or brought our conscious attention to it.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSorry about the multiple posts!
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe whole life after death issue is a very emotionally charged one. It ties in with religious beliefs which are themselves extremely emotionally charged. People WANT desperately to believe in god and life after death because otherwise there is no hope. We are born, we live, we die we are done; nothing survives. This line of thought triggers a gut denial as it touches on our survival instincts. I myself have recently "converted" to atheism after being a Christian minister since I was 14. I can look at both sides of the argument and have a good idea on how people think.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe bottom line is that if these "manifestations" are real we would have some proof. If ghost create an image that falls on our retinas the must emit light. This light would be readily captured in regular film. But we usually only get fuzzy images from people who have a vested interest in perpetuating the myths. So-called ghost chasers. In every instance where scientists have set up equipment to record these events nothing has happened. With all the interest and attempts to capture some proof we would have had hard evidence by now.
Or as I told a friend of mine: "Are you kidding if ghost were real we couldn't keep them OFF the TV! Look at how hard people try to get on TV you think this would change after they died? That out of the BILLIONS of people dead they wouldn't be popping up on TV everywhere they could get in front of a camera?"
We WANT to believe we continue on. As for the rest: hallucinations, premonitions, déjà-vu; the brain is a messy place and even our memories are re-written in accordance with want to believe.
Right before my mom died she had a dream that her father called her and told her it was really cold.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisRight before my mom died she told me her father called her on the phone and said it was really cold.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thismroto, challenging a theory isn’t as simple as saying, “I don’t believe you”. Once again, it is about proof. If you think that the experiences are caused by ghosts then go ahead and conduct an experiment and prove it. Do you really think the researcher should have conducted experiments to prove the experience was not caused ghosts? Should she have also conduct an experiment to prove the experience wasn’t caused by leprechauns, then another for fairies, perhaps another for demons? Maybe she should have made sure that none of the cast of Lord of the Rings was directly responsible for the phenomenon. This researcher was working under the hypothesis that these are hallucinations. This is a valid hypothesis as there is ample evidence to indicate they are hallucinations and no evidence to indicate that ghosts, demons, angels, etc exist. But, if the experiences aren’t hallucinations there will be some kind of signature in the data. There will be some indication that makes the hallucination theory inconsistent. That is then an opportunity for someone with a more elegant hypothesis to try and prove their point.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisFor some reason people seem to think that their lack of understanding of a phenomenon translates into the world’s lack of understanding of that phenomenon. Maybe you should consider that your inability to understand why the researcher has come to the conclusions they have is due to your ignorance rather than a flaw in theory. Ask yourself, how much have I actually researched this subject? Am I basing this entirely on my personal experience? By the way, people who are hallucinating don’t usually know they are hallucinating so for those people out there who say, “I know its real because I experienced it,” that statement clearly marks you as one who has no clue about human perception. You may as well start your diatribe with, “I am completely ignorant on this subject but I know…”
Now, it is fine to be ignorant. We are all ignorant about one thing or another. Nobody can know it all. What is sad is when ignorant people stand on their soap-box and share their ignorance with the world as though it were some amazing insight that no one had considered before. What’s worse is when those ignorant people believe policy should be set based on their uninformed opinions. The great thing about science is that it is a simple process anyone can follow. But until you’ve done it don’t expect that your opinion will be considered as relevant as someone who has methodically researched the subject.
What I said was, "The author of the article concludes that all instances of people sensing someone who has died are hallucinations, but gives no valid arguments for this conclusion."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisEmphasis on "all."
I also said that I agree that hallucinations are a plausible explanation of some of the sightings.
Emphasis on "some."
In the article, the author allows for nothing other than "all", but gives nothing to help convince the reader of this. In fact, the article is nothing more than opinion - not one fact based on evidence was given to support that ALL experiences were the result of hallucinations.
My beef with the article was not that hallucinations are a cause, but that they are the ONLY cause . In an Op-Ed piece, this is perfectly acceptable. But in a scientific publication, it's not.
By the way, flip comments about leprechauns, or whatever, don't enhance the discussion, nor do personal attacks (such as other respondents have done). It's okay to disagree. That's what makes such a debate interesting.
I do not believe in an afterlife, or supernatural phenomena, although I do sometimes wish there were a continuation of consciousness after death, something in addition to the coporeal world. Wish thinking does not make it so. However, I do believe, based on scientific evidence, that there are energies and forces in nature that are outside of our senses and possibly that are as yet, unknown or verifiable. The scientific evidence I refer to is in regard to light spectra that are not visible to our senses (e.g. gamma rays, ultra-violet, infra-red), forces that are not consciously felt by us (i.e. magnetism) and the like. I believe there are other energies, if you will, that are yet to be discovered, but I am not going to hedge my bets (without evidence) that the energy that leaves my body after I die, will go anywhere meaningful. It would be nice, but I won't hold my breath, since I need every bit of it to continue living this one-and-only life.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI have done research and understand scientific methodology. I agree with the comments regarding the researcher's conclusions. Until all other explanations have been disproved, there is no way to say that one particular explanation is the only one. I also have been trying to point out that as a scientifically-based person who understands the scientific method and has a significant body of scientific knowledge, I think that we still don't understand the way the universe works very well at all. There are too many questions left unanswered. As I said in an earlier post, Newton's 2nd Law (F=MA) is now being challenged. If this new theory proves to be true, we will have a whole new view of cosmology, and who knows where it will lead.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIf you have ever had a gut feeling, some intuition, or had a good feeling about something in your life that is about to happen, you have experienced another sense - not the five we commonly recognize as touch, sight, smell, taste, and hearing. If you ask a blind person how he navigates the world, he will likely tell you that he "senses" the world in a way that the sighted don't. We truly don't understand the workings of the brain, the mind, or our experience of consciousness. No MRI or EEG can tell us really why we experience these things. There is something unknown about the way we perceive reality. It can't be measured by a ruler or captured in a mathematical equation yet. There is research being done in this area of study, but there are no good answers yet. I have given my speculation in an earlier post, but that's all it is. If something so basic as a law in Newtonian physics is being challenged, then there is no reason why the field in which this author is researching is immune to new ideas, theories, or discoveries.
I suggest that those who are interested in expanding their view of reality read Jung's Treatise, "Synchronicity, An Acausal Principle". He convinced me that there are more ways to look at reality than just one way. While I do firmly believe in science and the scientific method, I think that those who refuse to consider other explanations for events can't see the forest for the trees, so to speak. While we may not yet have a scientific explanation for these experiences yet, I think that we will in the future - if researchers are willing to look for them!
mroto: "...My beef with the article was not that hallucinations are a cause, but that they are the ONLY cause .... flip comments about leprechauns, or whatever, don't enhance the discussion...."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisHuh? The "leprechauns" comment was absolutely valid and on point, even you personally don't accept it/understand it.
After all, by your own rules, you shouldn't be dismissing so easily the notion that, there are no ghosts, but only illusions created by bored leprechauns, to scare gullible humans.
Want some really good ghost stories from an actual sane scientist? Read "Demon Haunted World", by the one & only Carl Sagan. ...if you dare! OoooOOOOoooOOOooooo spooooooky....
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisA very strong smell of tobacco/cigarette smoke nearly overwhelmed me while I was driving. The windows were up and I was alone in a car that no one had ever smoked in. This sense of smell was repeated for several days until I said, "Paula (my sister who had just passed) is that you?" The smell disappeared immediately and has not happened since. I believe it was my sister contacting me.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisFor everyone who believes in ghosts and goblens and flying pink elephants have no proof either that there is life after death.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisJust because you "think" the keys magically disappeared doesn't mean it was paranormal. When you're stressed and running around and have a million things on your mind of course it seems that the keys were there then disappeared and then reappeared again. Scientific studies on the brain prove over and over that the mind can play tricks on you. Why do people always claim that just because they can't explain something that the only solution is the after-life or some other spiritual phenomenon?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisNow we all know that flying pink elephants don't exist right?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisTo jhubbsart (and everyone else that has tried to use some story as evidence):
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this<A very strong smell of tobacco/cigarette smoke nearly overwhelmed me while I was driving. The windows were up and I was alone in a car that no one had ever smoked in. This sense of smell was repeated for several days until I said, "Paula (my sister who had just passed) is that you?" The smell disappeared immediately and has not happened since. I believe it was my sister contacting me.>
Logical fallacy time:
I quote from Skeptiod.com show #73 "A Magical Journey through the Land of Logical Fallacies - Part 1"
"Anecdotal Evidence"
"One of the most common ways to support just about any non-evidence based phenomenon is through the fallacious misuse of anecdotal evidence. Anecdotal evidence is information that cannot be tested scientifically. In practice this usually refers to personal testimonials and verbal reports. Anecdotal evidence often sounds compelling because it can be more personal and captivating than cold, uninteresting factual evidence."
"Anecdotal evidence is not completely useless. You could say "We saw the Bigfoot corpse at such a location", and if that information helps with the recovery of an actual body, then the anecdotal evidence was of tremendous value. But, note that it's the Bigfoot corpse itself that comprises scientific evidence, not the story of where it was seen."
"I know for a fact that ghosts exist. My friend, who is a very reliable person, has seen ghosts on many occasions."
"Anecdotal evidence is great for suggesting new directions in research, but by itself it is not evidence. When it is presented as evidence or in place of evidence, you have very good reason to be skeptical."
AmericanAtheist have you read the article? You read the title and thought the author believes in ghosts. The article actually talks about the experiences that people are having are halucinations under stress and grieving. Or maybe I misunderstood you. Were you talking about the people's responses to the article?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisTo Angeladtao
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this<If you have ever had a gut feeling, some intuition, or had a good feeling about something in your life that is about to happen, you have experienced another sense - not the five we commonly recognize as touch, sight, smell, taste, and hearing.>
First off you need to get past this elementry school notion of 5 senses. There are far far far more sensery inputs to the brain than just the basic five. I'll name a few common ones and you can try and fit them into the basic five.
Sense of balance
Sense of time
Sense of space/self
Sense of hunger
Sense of pain
Second off, you are falling into the Logical Fallacy trap of "confirmation bias." You remeber the hits, but forget the misses. How many times have you had a good feeling, and nothing happened?
<If something so basic as a law in Newtonian physics is being challenged>
Got a link? My Google-fu is weak.
<I suggest that those who are interested in expanding their view of reality read Jung's Treatise, "Synchronicity, An Acausal Principle". He convinced me that there are more ways to look at reality than just one way.>
Carlos Castenada had an interesting way, too. The person on Youtube with schizophrenia - http://www.youtube.com/user/dbootsthediva. She has an interesting way of looking at reality. Metaphysics is fun, but in the end, Scientific evidence is what is needed.
peanutbutter, he is not saying that hallucinations are only caused by illness or stress or grieving, etc. He is saying that one of the common reasons for hallucinating is stress or mourning the death of a loved one.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisRe-read the beginning of the article. He didn't say that drugs do not make you hallucinate, he just said that most people think that only drugs make you hallucinate.
mroto; there are plenty of scientific studies on the matter. You should read articles and books In the field of psychology and neuro science.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThis would give you a clearer understanding of how the brain works and why we experience and behave the way we do.
I do believe that some people really believe in what they saw. But that's why they call it an hallucination, because it feels "real". At the moment, it's real to them.
I guess we find what we look for... when my son, at age 4, told me he had just finished talking to the nicest man who wanted him to tell me he was sorry he had never told me good bye, I guess he was hallucinating too! My father had died when I was 13 and went into a coma before I could get to see him one last time. I had never told anyone how this had bothered me. And what about those of us who can see people we have never met? I guess the answer is to medicate rather than have an open mind...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAnd if I were hallucinating, why would I conjure up my mother being bored at her funeral and asking my father to take her somewhere else! What a flat life it is without being open to the spirit world...
I rescued a beautiful cat many years ago. She had lived a very hard life until she came to us. Time passed and as we all do, she eventually . It was a quiet death with her loving family there to comfort her.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisA year or so later, I was in the cooking in the kitchen when our new Lab puppy began to bark furiously. I turned to see what had frightened her so and saw very clearly our departed Sophie peering in through the glass of the kitchen door. I picked up the puppy and started towards the door. As I did, the vision of kitty dissapeared.
It disturbs me to know that puppy was having hallucinations at such a young age. And what is worse, she had never known Sophie, so we can't even attribute her experience to grief. How sad.
By the way, I think Occam's is totally applicable here. The simplest answer is that "we", all of the Creator's children, continue in some form after the death of our body.
Headbang: "There is absolutely no reason at all to presume that any trace of our cognition would continue after the destruction of brain function."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThen explain why there are between 120 - 600 human beings known to continue to function as normal despite having little or no brain.
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140673607611271/fulltext
http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/0,1518,495607,00.html
http://www.flatrock.org.nz/_themes/flatrock_logo_slices_02.gif
Headbang: "There is absolutely no reason at all to presume that any trace of our cognition would continue after the destruction of brain function."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThen explain why there are known to be between 120 - 600 human beings with little or no brain who're otherwise known to function as normal.
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140673607611271/fulltext
http://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/0,1518,495607,00.html
http://www.flatrock.org.nz/_themes/flatrock_logo_slices_02.gif
Many neurologists claim this is merely a tribute to the brain's marvellous capacity for redundancy and its ability to reassign functions. But to quote Patrick Wall, professor of anatomy at University College, London states "To talk of redundancy is a cop-out to get around something you don't understand."
The same goes for the use of the term hallucination.
Never mind, unresolved questions like HOW do people hallucinate, or WHAT is a hallucination?
WHY do people hallucinate? If creatures went round the jungle seeing things that weren't there they'd go extinct over night - it doesn't make the first lick of evolutionary sense!
Read the book "Hello from heaven" where there are a lot of these stories. Many might be "hallucinations", but how could an hallucination tell you about something that you didn't know in advance, as the case of the Insurance receipt hidden in a closet?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisForgot to put the link to the Authors of the book:
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thishttp://www.after-death.com/
Cheers!
I totally agree with peanutbutter. I have experienced many things from the after life. I know that I was not hallcinating. Here, Here !!!!!!!!!
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI totally agree with peanutbutter. I have experienced may a visit from the after life and I can assure you that I was not hallucinating. Touche. Well put peanut B.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIt;s really too bad that you live in such a small world , oh well , I need to remember that we are all on the same path , some are just further behind.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisMost are missing the point of the article which is that many people who lose a loved one (human or animal) have some kind of post death meeting with that departed friend. My friend Jane, a wonderful Jack Russel terrier, who was poisoned somehow made it back into my world three times after her death each in a different way. My grief for her lives on and although I cannot rule out the idea that I merely wanted some kind of connection with her to remain in the present, I also cannot say that I did not create these meetings out of a terrible longing to be reunited with her once more. I think the human mind is able to build any reality that it wants when it hurts very deeply. In any event I know my mind in fact did perceive my dead dogs presence in very substantive ways many days after I laid her to rest in the back yard.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisPeanutbutter, your my hero!
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisPeanutbutter, your my hero!
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisQuotation:"think mroto has made a very valid point. Science is about the reproducible, measurable, observer-independent phenomena that make up most of our experience."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWell, it depends on a point of view!
What is called SCIENCE in the European Culture is actually a very flowed and corrupted system of looking at and analyzing manifested phenomenological reality!
It is based upon the false assumption that the "external" reality has its objective existence and only experiencing it entity can be subjective...
The missing point here is that only an idea can be objective but not a phenomenological experience of an entity.
For instance, the idea or the concept of a tree falling in a forest doesn`t need any witness to be true.However the tree falling in the forest needs the witness who can state that the event from HIS/HER point of view has taken place. This experience may be considered as objective or real or true from the point of view of that observing entity, however to anyone else it is simply subjective.
The whole European thinking and hence the culture is based upon the dualistic paradigm assuming that what human beings collectively perceive MUST have its objective existence not taking into consideration that the "received" perception is always only a limited one, although frequently repeated manifestation of the unlimited ways the "same reality"can manifest itself to a perceiving it entity...
Philosophically correct is the statement that what appears to each of us is always the function of the data input through the senses and data processing. The output is what we "see"! And that is always relative, subjective and limited! Thanks for your attention.
Quotation:"think mroto has made a very valid point. Science is about the reproducible, measurable, observer-independent phenomena that make up most of our experience."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWell, it depends on a point of view!
What is called SCIENCE in the European Culture is actually a very flowed and corrupted system of looking at and analyzing manifested phenomenological reality!
It is based upon the false assumption that the "external" reality has its objective existence and only experiencing it entity can be subjective...
The missing point here is that only an idea can be objective but not a phenomenological experience of an entity.
For instance, the idea or the concept of a tree falling in a forest doesn`t need any witness to be true.However the tree falling in the forest needs the witness who can state that the event from HIS/HER point of view has taken place. This experience may be considered as objective or real or true from the point of view of that observing entity, however to anyone else it is simply subjective.
The whole European thinking and hence the culture is based upon the dualistic paradigm assuming that what human beings collectively perceive MUST have its objective existence not taking into consideration that the "received" perception is always only a limited one, although frequently repeated manifestation of the unlimited ways the "same reality"can manifest itself to a perceiving it entity...
Philosophically correct is the statement that what appears to each of us is always the function of the data input through the senses and data processing. The output is what we "see"! And that is always relative, subjective and limited! Thanks for your attention.
I love the photo at the top of this article. It calls to mind a cat's eye as it contemplates its human companion. Very appropriate for the topic. Wonderful selection.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIt is interesting how polarized this theme appears. Likely, future research will find completelly unexpected and dissapointed resuls for both sides of the spectrum. For example we may find that scientific proof of survival has no bearings at all on supernatural longings, God or any particular religious dogma. Physical theoretical schemes for acomodate the existence and interaction with brains of hipothetical surviving entities have been various in the history of this field. The latest one is based on hierarquical modelling of Dark Matter structures.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSee for example:
http://cavekitty.ca/db_origin.pdf http://www.helsinki.fi/~matpitka/pdfpool/exonuclear.pdf
specially: http://www.helsinki.fi/~matpitka/articles/fermieng.pdf
The author concludes that "The hierarchy of dark matter corresponds to a hierarchy of conscious entities...", "It could also be that we are in some sense ”cells” of these higher level conscious entities and that they communicate to us all the time..."
http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0810/0810.5126v1.pdf
the author expresses the idea that "dark biology is not far behind. Someday perhaps we’ll be exchanging signals with the dark internet."
http://ezinearticles.com/?Dark-Matter---Plasma-of-Super-Particles&id=1240357
the author "has been researching on terrestrial dark plasma (TDP) life forms, including their evolution in the dark biosphere and their habitats..."
Observationally, nobody doing this research is implying that what survives is all the complex of our personality enbodied in our brain. Jim B. Tucker, M.D. use the term "carryover" for what fragment or fragments could do so. See: Journal of Scientific Exploration. Number 3. Fall 2007.
Cheers Scientific American for let open this dialogue!
JZA
Well, I am sorry about the cat.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisCheck out http://noosphere.princeton.edu/ for some interesting work performed by Princeton University in to how consciousness can directly influence random physical processes. This research suggests there might be more to consciousness than just the 'brain in a body' idea.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisCheck out http://noosphere.princeton.edu/ for some interesting work performed by Princeton University in to how consciousness can directly influence random physical processes. This research suggests there might be more to consciousness than just the 'brain in a body' idea.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWe now know that all consciousness is a quantum phenomenon, and, therefore not dependent upon the 'wetware' of our neurologic systems for it to operate. Your Brain is to your Spirit as this computer monitor you're reaading now is to the Internet; there is a little 'mind' nearby, in the box feeding the monitor, but it merely translates/processes/displays the incoming information product for your comprehension. There is no more reason to suppose that the communicating "dead" are 'halleucinations' than that this web page, being legibly presented, is merely the detritus accidentally left by a software 'glitch'.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThe fact of life-after-death is attested to by a mountain of empirical evidence. NDE/OBE experiencers accurate report the sights and sounds occurring around their "dead" bodies, not only duriing clinical death but during brain death as well, in deep hypothermia. More telling, they accurately report seeing/hearing things out in the hallway, on other floors of the building, even across town or around the world, which are later confirmed to have taken place at the time they were "dead". Moreover, third parties have seen, heard, or otherwise sensed the presence of the NDE experiencer while he/she was out of body, even when such percipients had no way of knowing they were in trauma at the time. NDE experiencers report seeing dead friends and relatives - including ones they had no way of knowing were dead at the time. Past life accounts of reincarnated children have been meticulously confirmed in great detail, by those who knew the deceased person they believe themselves to have previously been. There are over a million EVP recordings, millions of ghost observations, and tens of millions of accurate messages conveyed by mediums, reflecting knowledge only the dead communicant could have imparted.
There is no death and there are no dead. More to the point, there is no contradictory factual evidence. To cloak 'skepticism' in science does an injustice to both philosophies. Fundamentalist dogma once denied that the Earth is round, today it denies that we exist in a larger cosmic context than 4-D spacetime. Unless the scientific enterrprise abandons 'the dogma of skepticism' for 'the curiousity of truth', it will fail to be relevant to the human future.
We cannot ascribe all such experiences to hallucinations; but we must be somewhat brave to say that ghosts of the dead do exist, and that we shall be some ghosts following our death.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThis matter of ghosts and souls is so confused: truth has been mixed with hallucinations and delusions.
http://man-after-death.t35.com/#What_Is_Man_
http://man-after-death.t35.com/#What_Is_Death_
There have been many experiences that cannot be explained by such halluciantion.
E.g. I am a medical doctor (: general practitioner); I was over 40, my son was about 14 or 15 years; I went to visit my uncle (living in our family big house); it was afternoon time just before sunset, the sky was cloudy, and there was not much light, and in it was yet darker in the room where we sat; then through the window glass I saw someone with a white shirt come hurriedly walking along the lane to the kitchen, and he passed outside the room where we sat, but I did not see his face; I thought he was my brother (also a doctor working in another city) so I jumped to meet him from the door near to me, but there was none there; I went to the door of the kitchen, I found it closed, and I went to the kitchen from inside the house and there was none; so I realized it was the soul of my dead father who exactly similar in body frame to my brother.
But I said to my uncle to my uncle: it might be some sheet of clothes that came by the wind that which I saw.
But my son who sat besides me said: "No father, I also saw him", and he added: "I saw his face with whitish appearance, but I could not see details of his face."
And there are many other observations by many people that cannot be explained by such hallucinations; yes there are such hallucinations and misinterpretations of things, but you have to admit the existence of another spiritual world of souls which is invisible, and which we all will see when we die sooner or later.
eanassir
http://man-after-death.t35.com
To PressToDigitate <We now know that all consciousness is a quantum phenomenon>
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisNo it isn't, if you had any understanding of quantum mechanics you would see how ridiculous the above statement is. The same quarks and electrons, bosons and leptons make up everything around us, from your brain to the sun. Rocks aren't conscious. We don't have ghost leaves. I don't suddenly grab for an ethereal soda can cause it was having an out of body experience.
<Your Brain is to your Spirit as this computer monitor you're reading now is to the Internet; there is a little 'mind' nearby, in the box feeding the monitor, but it merely translates/processes/displays the incoming information product for your comprehension.>
do an experiment; smash you monitor/CPU. Can you still see the internet page? Smash another monitor. Smash as many monitors as you can before you get a ghost internet page that lived on after the monitor was smashed.
Monitors and computer work with electrons so they should give us the "quantum phenomenon" you hold is high esteem.
I see anecdotes. I don't see controlled experiments. I don't see data. I don't see proof.
<Unless the scientific enterrprise abandons 'the dogma of skepticism' for 'the curiousity of truth', it will fail to be relevant to the human future.>
Science is not a Dogma. Science is self correcting, it is peer reviewed, it is adaptive. If it occurs it will be found out by science. Science can never disprove the existence of ghosts, but ghosthunters can never get any actual evidence to prove they exist.
You can't compare "the Earth is round" people to "there are ghost" people. The earth is round people had a handful of equations, and tests and notes and real Data. The ghost people have stories, and "so-and-so said", and colorful anecdotes.
Data changes the world.
Stories give you goose bumps around the camp fire.
Hey, I think these experiences could be of aliens. They are probably hanging around trying to spook us!! Well, it could be.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisScientists are looking for aliens but they dismiss ghosts as hallucinations... they believe in God but they think spirits do not exist... and once upon a time they believed in ether while laughed at the existence of atoms...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thishonestly, if someone has never experienced an extra sensory perception of any kind then most cannot believe. but if you have.... then you have no doubt. its that simple. no scientific reasoning could ever convince me that my experiences werent real. I know they happened and really in the long run thats all that matters to me.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIt is possible to hallucinate the phantom presence of a lover who has left but is still alive. One morning upon waking after a painful breakup I felt my lost love lying in the bed next to me. I could not see her, but her warmth could be felt, the bed felt as if it sloped towards the phantom presence and I could faintly hear her breathing. It was touch/auditory hallucination.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisWhat about precognitions--getting advance warnings from "out there" of when people are going to die? I'm a rational, non-tree hugging individual. Yet, I cannot rationally explain how these fully-formed knowing have come to me --and in a variety of venues and at a variety of times in my life, starting from childhood. Science, explain this--please.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thiswhat 120 - 600? - I looked up those links - flatrock didn't work and the other two are both about the same case - the tax worker - who does not have 'no brain', but merely swollen ventricles that reduce his gross amount of brain tissue(and his IQ!). See TED talks on neurology - intelligence is not related to brain size but complexity.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSusan Gale 'And if I were hallucinating, why would I conjure up my mother being bored at her funeral and asking my father to take her somewhere else! ' By the same logic - why would your mother visit you from beyond the grave 'being bored at her funeral... etc' ?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisAnd please desist from the emotional blackmail of using a child to promote your argument - stories of ghosts are precisely children's stories - and also I resent the way you imply that people who don't believe in the 'spirit world' are somehow lacking in imagination or joy or humanity - that's the same tried and tired con that religions have always used to justify their nonsense
EvolvingApe - yup - kookies and woo woo nuts - even Doctors believing in ghosts - just goes to show that being intelligent enough to achieve a degree doesn't necessarily stop you being stupid. Most of the believers seem to think that the article says that their experiences are not valid (because the explanation is scientific rather than spiritual) - but the article plainly allows that there are valuable psychological and physical benefits to these experiences. I suspect that it's more that all the while they keep the 'spiritual' or 'beyond science' pigeon-hole for difficult phenomena they don't have to actually use their brains and go to the trouble of justifying rather childish beliefs. They would sooner be guided by a bogeyman than have a nasty rational scientist spoiling their little fairyland.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisEveryone believes in the afterlife - you can't help it - it's simply fear of annihilation processed through our evolved brain and acculturated mind - but that doesn't mean you have to live as though it's true - and it doesn't make death any less terrifying or ineffable.
Everyone believes in rainbows - but a rainbow contains the whole spectrum of light - it's our eyes, brains and minds that create the colours of the rainbow - but that doesn't make them any less awesome or beautiful...
alanborky - as the article allows, we have evolved these functions precisely because they allow us to cope better with the brute fact of death - they do not have to be spiritual or unscientific to be effective,
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisJaguarsky - Occam's Razor - as others have replied does not need theories to be 'simple' but to have the least assumptions needed - your last paragraph contains the huge assumption (i.e. statement without evidence) that we are all the 'children of our Creator' - well I for one, am not - I am the child of my parents and that's all.
Kritof - 'Hallucinating due to grief caused by the passing of recent loved ones is an assumption' - No - in the article it is a THEORY, open to proof or disproof by research - of neurological evidence like brain scans during hallucinations etc.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisthanks for a bit of sense...
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thispeanutbutter - quoting the bible is the last refuge of weak thinking -. People who don't believe are jealous? I'm afraid not. Your comments are patronising and smug as all religious opinions are. Here's the news - god does not exist, the bible is just a collection of stories and anyone who has ever claimed to know the mind or will of god is deluded and / or a liar.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThis issue isn't about life after death, not even about minds and hallucinations; it's about the difference between the Myers-Briggs thinkers and feelers.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisA word of advice to scientists who say anecdotes are not science must remember that not all of science is experimental in nature--take anthropology for example which the author of the article just happens to mention.....
Keep in mind also, that scientists take much on heresay (yes, because no scientist redoes the experiments of those that preceed their work, there is not the time or money to do that--you simply trust in their work)--and sometimes the work being accepted is faked or flawed. In other words not perfect--so there is room for critical thinking even when viewing what seems to be hard facts.
A word of advice to religious/spiritual types--keep in mind that you can't change their minds without proof. However, not all proofs need to be carried out in the physical realm of a science laboratory. Mathematical proofs have existed for much longer than modern scientific methods.
Idea for all to consider---one side calls them hallucinations and insists the visions/visitations of ghosts and the dead cannot be measured. The other side insists they are real, having experienced them. Perhaps the mind is the key to understanding, and what is given the label of hallucination is really the means to capture the unseeable. Perhaps in time we will develop some sort of objective machine to measure their presence that will confirm sightings as more than simple hallucinations-- but in the meantime--we all end up going backwards by not keeping an open mind to the possibilities presented on either side.
That is the major difficulty some have pointed out with this --less than scientifically reported information. Information shared seems to have come from anecdotal records and interviews, but the conclusions categorically lump ALL these situations into the category of hallucination. There does not seem to be any accompanying brain research to pinpoint location of these sensations/visions/hallucinations...
Perhaps the author did more than research/interview and justly deserves the right to label them all as hallucinations--but we can't take that on say so alone--we need to see the proof.
I too have had many encounters with my deceased family members. I feel there is a correlation to this post of which my grandfather, an aunt, a great aunt, my father in law, a couple best friends, and one patient have made statements to me that they have seen a family member come to visit them after they have awaken from a nap... with in a time frame of two weeks to one year, these people have passed on too. Why am I the one they tell these things to? Just today my dear friend told me she has been having visits from her mother and her husband both deceased. She has wanted to come visit for many years and never thought there would be the chance to do so... at 90 years of age a friend brought her back to see a place here she call home for 40 years. After visiting her husbands grave she told me about her visit from him and her mother. After all our conversations over the past two days things are beginning to make sense. I hope she has a few more years but at this age who knows but her older sister is still living and she needs to be here for her. No one knows the time or the place however if we are open to listen someone will tell us secrets that if we put it all together we can unlock the unknown before they are gone. I will report more as time goes on if any one is interested.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this