Such glibness can have consequences far worse than a group of grumpy, exhausted engineers, sleep scientists say. "It's a little shortsighted because you can spend hundreds of millions of dollars on a mission but not pay attention to human factors, and that's one of the things that can easily go really, really wrong," Lockley says.
The problem will most likely get more attention if NASA eventually sends a manned mission to Mars. The astronauts on such a mission would probably adapt to the sol with relative ease because they would be receiving all the appropriate light-dark signals, sleep scientists predict. But if it was a prolonged mission that lasted months or years, NASA would have to become more proactive about helping people entrain to a Mars schedule or else come up with an alternative staffing plan for its support crew back on Earth.
Otherwise, it could face another mutiny.
Check in later this week for my posts to the Expeditions Blog on my own experiment to see how it feels to live on Mars time.
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Add CommentLast I read, most people's natural circadian rhythms are closer to 25 hours than 24. (Those experiments were done with the people being isolated from natural light.) The problem in the cases sited here were that the people were still having their clocks reset by daylight. If people ever actually lived on Mars, I would expect there not to be any serious problems with this issue since day/night timing would still be in sync with their active and sleeping times.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisIndeed. The average human's circadian rhythm is actually closer to a Martian day than an Earth day. I would expect most people would actually be happier with a Martian photoperiod.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisA word from the cynic:
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisLet's get real. I haven't seen any scheme for a manned Mars mission that is not held aloft by childish wishful thinking and laughably unrealistic hazard assessment. If anything goes even slightly wrong, at any stage, they're dead. Any person foolish enough to volunteer for a vastly expensive, completely pointless, trip to Mars, is not sane enough to be selected. (Convicted murderers may rationallly prefer it to a cell on death row [to which it would be identical], only because of the increased odds of escape prior to lift-off.) Even if they somehow touch-down on the planet mostly alive, what would they do? Stumble around a few yards from their prison into a virtual vacuum of dusty waste while their internal organs are slowly fried by radiation? You call that "exporation?" Rovers already there have completed 20x the amount of useful science that a desperate person on the edge of insanity could do.
I understand that there is a legion of scientists who must protect their income by making out that a manned Mars mission is some high-minded objective. That's baloney. At some point people are going to die horribly, and pointlessly, from this whole "Manned exploration of Mars" hoax.
We need to be vastly more advanced technologically, and then, find some useful purpose, before we try to send a person safely to Mars.
Ah, I see, SteveinOG. So, we should never try, because we can never make the trip completely safe, eh? And for that matter, the science generated regarding long-term human survival in both free-fall and the Martian environment is utterly useless too. I see.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSorry, but no. Just because YOU are too short-sighted to see the real science that can be accomplished by a manned Mars mission, doesn't mean the science isn't there. I advise you to do some actual research, rather than engage in self-satisfied assumptions that don't actually reflect reality. You'll look far less like a fool.
Listening to people like you is exactly what will doom our race.
SteveinOG I agree that getting to and living in a Martin environment is going to be incredibly challenging. We're not ready yet. However I think founding a self sustaining Martian colony is a valid objective, if only as an insurance policy against a catastrophic event on earth.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisHaving a group of people on mars would be both crazy and amazing. Whoever went to mars, would have to know its a one way trip. End of story. And be happy with this. That would be the hardest part. Being content with your decision to never return to your home. It would be like the pioneers crossing america, only on a much crazier and scary level. I personally couldn't do this. But I know a couple people that probably would see this as an amazing opportunity, and a way to enter the record books. All i can say to those who would/will do this. YOU GO GIRL/BOY!
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisSteve claims: "...seen any scheme for a manned Mars mission that is not held aloft by childish wishful thinking..."
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisThen you haven't looked at too many, or any of these projects, developed by very competent people who would easily prove everything you said to be BELOW childish & wishful thinking.
Steve claims: "...anything goes even slightly wrong, at any stage, they're dead...
Nonsense. Things go wrong all the time on in all kinds of missions of equal danger or worse. Usually there are fixes or workarounds. Take a look at Apollo 13. Nobody died and that is a VERY, VERY wrong, indeed disastrous event. So no, your claim is obviously ridiculous, and shows your post to have no credibility.
Steve claims "..Any person foolish enough to volunteer for a vastly expensive, completely pointless, trip to Mars, is not sane enough to be selected.."
Another ridiculous statement. There would be and already are volunteers of the highest qualifications and character, far beyond your own. Many of the best & brightest give up their lives climbing some mountain for dubious reasons, nothing at all as important as being the first humans to COLONIZE another world.
The rest of your claims are beneath ridiculous. Let's just take one that you have staked your reputation on:
Steve claims "...Stumble around a few yards from their prison ... their internal organs are slowly fried by radiation..."
Wrong.
"...A person ambling around the Red Planet would receive an average dose of about 0.7 millisieverts per day, while astronauts aboard the International Space Station experience an average daily dose between 0.4 and 1.0 millisieverts..."
cbsnews.com/8301-205_162-57557075/nasa-astronauts-could-survive-mars-radiation/
The World's foremost authorities on Radiation Health Physics have determined anything less than 3 mSv/day exposure is harmless and natural environments on Earth do expose people to those levels with no observed ill effects.
They should have hired me. I'd love Mars time. What other people I'm not needing to have consistently at hand are up to, or whether it is light or dark, is of no concern to me, but my body naturally stays awake longer than will fit into a 24 hour day and also provide me 7 1/2 hours of sleep. A 26-28 hour day would suite me much better; 24 and 29/60ths hours would be a step in my direction.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisOf course most people, whether they spend more time working than anything else and/or more time acting as if daylight is not a factor, like I do, or not, ARE on a natural cycle closer to 24 hours than I am, or at least BELIEVE that they ought to be, although I can't imagine why a person would want to be other than as they in fact are, I'm told people commonly do.
I wonder what would happen if they put some people on ISS on martian time for an extended period of time and used them to work with some of these martian probes?
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisProof that we came from Mars! :-)
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to this@dwbd, well there were the Thresher and Scorpion expeditions by the US Navy. Things went wrong. Things went badly.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisEVERYBODY DIED.
Steve I happen to agree with you. There are just too many insurmountable obstacles to be overcome for a permanent settlement on Mars to be successful. Although I love Star Trek (and other similar shows) I believe that it has caused many people to have unrealistic (pie in the sky) expectations of what is achievable.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI meant to add that I agree with SteveinOG's opinion on the relative safety and practicality of the trip to and from Mars as well.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisI would much prefer to see meaningful exploitation of the moon before going to mars with a manned mission.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisInteresting, but that would not cancel the time lag needed for signals to travel between ISS and Mars. That could be done on Earth, with far more access to equipment and replacement crew. The ISS crew is small and quite busy with other efforts.
Reply | Report Abuse | Link to thisNatural circadian rhythms come close to mars time. However, the time children go to school and a spouse goes to work does not match such a schedule. The problem could be solved by putting the entire community on Mars time. OK kids it is 1 am. Time to get up and go to school.
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